Shooting issues

[Dcoy]

Was going to tack this on to Fallguys wind drift post but didn't want to hi-jack it cause thats a key issue and a great topic all by itself.Nevertheless,that post or thread and my recent experience I mentioned there got me thinking and tinkering again.
Years ago when I was really into the long range accuracy stuff,I used to argue with people a lot about 'little'things that have big impacts on accuracy.One was trigger pull.(not weight-I doubt anyone can be real accurate over 3lbs)Where you place your finger,your grip,your technique,etc.If you know great bench rest shooters you know what I'm talking about.These guys have a routine(grip,position,etc)that does not vary once established and will nearly fight over whether you 'pull' or 'push' or 'squeeze' a trigger.(most 'push')Ditto on just where your finger should touch the trigger.Should it be the 'pad'before the first joint?(I guess the most sensitive part of the finger)The first joint?Farther back?
Anyway I'm,as you may recall,pretty new to the fixed Harris type bipod and my recent experience sitting in the wind with what til up to then I thought was a near bench rest solid system still moved so much at 10 power that I resorted to the prone position and even resorted to stacking cowpies to get a pretty solid rest.
All this took me outside to do(what I should have done before)some shooting from the sitting position,in moderate wind,at distance.(300 yds)Wow,an eye opener.I could vary my group significantly by just slightly changing my grip and trigger finger position.Vary enough to cause a miss on a coyote!I'm not much of a math guy and never really understood the 'angle of the dangle'arguments that indicate putting the trigger on the 'pad'before the first joint allowed you to 'push'the trigger straight back consistently but after this experiment I understand the results a bit.A pretty darn important issue off a bipod.Something that will/DOES affect your accuracy.
After this my feelings are trigger finger position and practice(dry firing)is very important and if you want to improve your accuracy,experiment a bit with it.Any 'probs' will be magnified off a bipod or sticks thats for sure.An easy,smooth,consistent 'push'is critical cause on a bipod,anything else creates inaccuracy.Wail away but I believe it and urge you to try it.
Sorry this is so long.

[Coyotehunter]

when I started shooting silhuette league is when I found every mistake I made exggerated. amazing how little things will have huge effects down range. This is one of the reasons why years ago I went to shooting prone from a bipod. I have down a fair amount of practiceing from a sitting position with a bipod but the groups are just never as tight. A lot of terrain does not lend itself to prone position and that is why I started carring a shotgun out to most stands. Just to improve my ratio with those coyotes that will come all the way. Which is more often than you would imagine if you just stay calm and let it happen.

[Dcoy]

Hi again.I was in a rush to get to a coyote stand in the dark this morning cause I thought I had a cinch set up-Ha!(our old freezer in the garage died and we didn't know it til it stunk and there was blood all over the floor.Lost a deer,part of an elk and lots of birds-Damn!However I hauled it all out in the loader and dumped it were I thought I could 'kill em easy'-Ha again.)
Anyway now when I reread my post I see I may have given an impression thats not what I meant to say.I'm not saying the correct position of your trigger finger is on the 'pad'before the first joint although I think most do it that way and it seems best for me(I'm nearly at the joint though),all I'm saying is wherever your position is,some testing/tinkering might get you to change it or at least teach you how important consistency and care in 'touching it off' is-especially from an extended bipod.
Good hunting!

[lyonch]

I understand Dcoy. I use to shoot in the crease of the knuckle. Now i shoot with the pad of my finger. It has tightened my groups up quite a bit. I think there are a lot more nerve endings in the end of the finger than in the crease any you should be able to tell right when it should go off. this summer is going to be practice, practice, practice.

[Fallguy]

I use my pad of my finger before the first joint. And I try to squeeze the trigger not yank it. I will admit I do not have the nerves of a surgeon I like my caffeine WAY to much.

[Dcoy]

Yeh,I hear ya about the caffeine!

[Prairie Ghost]

Trigger pull can make a huge difference just try shooting the first two for the day with the shotgun and then have one hang up and try making a good shot under pressure with a rifle it can be messy Everyone is different on where they like the feel for things myself i like the most feel i can get.

[Dcoy]

Just walked back into the house from a memorable moment down at one of my sloughs.My tinkering with the bipod,dry and live firing with it etc,,just paid off.
Sittin there glassing my spoiled meat pile and the slough edge at dawn with the 220 improved.The honkers on an island start acting up(waddling out on the ice,alarm honking,etc)so I was ready when Wiley walked off one end and started humping across.Pretty steady hold just ahead of where his neck meets his chest and bang,flop.He was rolling around so I hit him again as well.Could hear the 'wops'.Not yet sure where I hit but will know soon.Gonna get me a long stick,ice picks,and a life vest before waddling out there.Open on the edges and true 'black ice'as of yesterday.
Anyway,practice pays!For what its worth,here's where I've ended up personally when in the sitting position:
1.In significant wind,I grip the base of the bipod(where it attaches to the rifle).
2.In other conditions,I've adopted a crossed leg,indian style sit with my off hand not touching the rifle except the bottom of the trigger guard-elbow on my knee.Whatever works for you though of course but experimenting may show major differences in 'steadiness'.
I'll measure this but suspect its about a 400 yd walking shot.
This will definitely end my season unless a rancher calls.A sweet ending though!
Good hunting and good off season!

[Prairie Ghost]

Practice always pays off in the long run

[Q-Wagoner]

I am a bit of a trigger snob myself. I like them light but not too light. For hunting, 2 to 2 and a half pounds is what I feel comfortable with. Shooting and trigger technique is also a must for making those longer shots. Out to 200 or so yards I am not as disciplined as I am at longer ranges. At 200 yards or under you really just need to be steady to kill coyotes at 400 and beyond you better be holding your toes right. LOL

I think part of being a true rifleman means you can shoot accurately under different circumstances with a wide variety of holds. For long-range shots I shoot prone or I normally don’t shoot. I sight my rifle in with the same technique I use for long-range hunting. When I put my rifle in my stix I know I will have a slightly different POI than I will off of my bipods and I know if I shoot off of the hood of my pickup I will have a different impact point also. This slight difference will not make a lick of difference to a coyote at normal calling ranges but when the long-range opportunity is all that is offered I know what I need to do to make the shot.

There is no doubt that different holds on your rifle will cause different impact points so it is a good idea to sight your rifles in, while using the same hold and technique you most often use in the field.

Good hunting.

Q,

[5.56]

Alot of good points here! After I came from from Nam in '71 and was suffering from PTSD, I just knew I needed to get out into the woods to 'unwhind' alittle. However, on opening day of deer gun season started, I woke up! Woke up, that is to how little I liked being shot at! I thought I was alone but at first dawn and first deer movment, I had idiots close by shooting at 'sounds'!
So, I quit gun hunting and went back to archery. Not only was that more of a challange, but I latter started the tournament circuit! One important lesson I learned from archery was to 'pick a spot', and to let down if the shot didn't 'feel' right!
Now, much older and back into guns again, I know the lessons I learned from archery have helped me to be a better long range gun shooter also!
Many gun shooters will not or can not 'let down' and start over if something don't feel correct. They'll go ahead and bang a shot off with usually bad results.
Breath control, trigger control, picking a spot, and letting down and starting over if needed will make each one of your shots better!
Sure, we're out there to 'kill' things, but to do it humanely, quickly and efficiently will not only be better for the game we hunt, but our overall enjoyment of the sport as well!

Good Shooting!

[Q-Wagoner]

Couldn't agree with you more. Well said.

Good hunting.

Q,

[lyonch]

I was told by an old war vet that trained some of the snipers in WWII that "when you aim small you miss small" He told me to not just aim at the bullseye on the target but rather the smallest spot that i can imagine within it. There are a lot of factors to shooting and the only way that i know how to get better at having them become second nature is practice, practice, practice.

[Coyotehunter]

I got my first bow when I was 8 and have enjoyed shooting a bow every since. A bad release with an arrow at 20 yards is a missed target. You do have to learn with a bow to start over if things do not feel right. It is no different with a rifle and scope. I had for years a target stuck to the living room wall that I dry fired at all the time. Great practice.

[Prairie Ghost]

The aim small miss small mentality is something everyone really needs to sit down and think about because it makes such a huge difference